RedDarkArmor

Play Now

Phawk

Chronicles Moderator
Dedicated Member
Jun 29, 2011
318
2
45
York, UK
EW hits 370 with flamefield, 360 with blizzard and i'm assuming 550 with meteor strike when he gets it. All without red poison. The fact that a wizards AOE, does a lot more damage than an archers single point damage is far beyond my understanding.

A wizard only needs this extra HP for PvP, where they can already 1 hit kill assassins, taoists and archers. It's a shame the armour is pretty pointless, it should be given some bonus over other robes, but I don't think HP is the way to go. I'd say make it MC5-5, BDA is fine at 1-2, GDA 0-4, Gold DA is 2-2 if i'm not mistaken and dark armour 1-2.

this +1. A wizard doesn't need more survivability. Ad yes have used FF, and sent more of my life than care to mention on PT 3rd. I get how it works. Wiz survivability is fine as is. As for the extra stat, i'd support dropping it for an extra MC.

/Mark
 

Rollcage

LOMCN Veteran
Veteran
May 11, 2013
372
7
44
EW hits 370 with flamefield, 360 with blizzard and i'm assuming 550 with meteor strike when he gets it. All without red poison. The fact that a wizards AOE, does a lot more damage than an archers single point damage is far beyond my understanding.

A wizard only needs this extra HP for PvP, where they can already 1 hit kill assassins, taoists and archers. It's a shame the armour is pretty pointless, it should be given some bonus over other robes, but I don't think HP is the way to go. I'd say make it MC5-5, BDA is fine at 1-2, GDA 0-4, Gold DA is 2-2 if i'm not mistaken and dark armour 1-2.

and ive seen archers hit for 340ish with fireshot, and they didnt even need to be within 2 spaces of thier target..
go to orcs on a wiz and try n walk past 1 slasher and 1 sorc and tell me again wiz only need hp for pvp.
but like said, this thread isnt about getting HP specifically, its about getting a stat that isnt USELESS

---------- Post Merged at 05:39 PM ---------- Previous Post was at 05:35 PM ----------

this +1. A wizard doesn't need more survivability. Ad yes have used FF, and sent more of my life than care to mention on PT 3rd. I get how it works. Wiz survivability is fine as is. As for the extra stat, i'd support dropping it for an extra MC.

/Mark

what is this nonesense?
no one NEEDS more survivability, but an in item set thats supposed to give that, having 1 that does nothing seems ok to you?
why would u even mention PT as if thats a benchmark? PT is a LOW lvl cave with mobs that can be stunned with magic spells.
 

Phawk

Chronicles Moderator
Dedicated Member
Jun 29, 2011
318
2
45
York, UK
and ive seen archers hit for 340ish with fireshot, and they didnt even need to be within 2 spaces of thier target..
go to orcs on a wiz and try n walk past 1 slasher and 1 sorc and tell me again wiz only need hp for pvp.
but like said, this thread isnt about getting HP specifically, its about getting a stat that isnt USELESS

---------- Post Merged at 05:39 PM ---------- Previous Post was at 05:35 PM ----------


Why would u even mention PT as if thats a benchmark? PT is a LOW lvl cave with mobs that can be stunned with magic spells.

Read my post in context and you will get the relevance. You asked if I understood how FF works.

Keeping the post on topic - and calming it down slightly. I'm not denying that the MP is useless for a wiz, I agree with you there. HP though would just make them too strong. MP regen would certainly be a nice touch. You could maybe look at 10% anti magic maybe ? An exra MC ?

10% anti-magic keeps the robe in line with the class expectations/lore - and would certainly help. Not sure if this might make them a bit OP in PVP though. What are your thoughts ?

/Mark
 

Clintus2

Dedicated Member
Dedicated Member
Jan 31, 2014
394
4
45
Sorry peeps but i have to 100% agree with Rollcage on this one.

As for wiz's being OP, a small % of wiz's have leveled to over 50 and quite frankly why would they NOT be powerful??!!

im a 44 wiz, have average kit etc and can be 1 hit by a 40 Sin/War, can I 1 hit them....NO do i scream and shout that they are "OP" NO because i chose a squishy class. EvilWoman can be 1 hit by a 45 Sin can he 1 hit without red poison a 45 Sin or Warrior?.....Not Often.

JUST BECAUSE A MINORITY OF WIZ'S HAVE GOT OVER 50 AND HAVE THE KIT TO BE POWERFUL DOES NOT MEAN ALL WIZ'S OVER 44 ARE OP!!!!

I was 1 hit by Bullpit last night, dropped a dstaff, am I whingeing? no I was a twat and I suck at PVP end of.

The armour is as much use as a chocolate teapot atm yet is rare as hens teeth, what is the point in it??

and this "go to orcs on a wiz and try n walk past 1 slasher and 1 sorc and tell me again wiz only need hp for pvp."
 
Last edited:

Mystickiller

Bored AF
Untrusted Member
Golden Oldie
Dec 24, 2003
1,007
4
174
Minnesota, USA
I've been going to orcs on my archer since 38...Learn to use your clone. Rep it into mobs and shock easy to survive. Something an archer can't do aswell as use shield witch cuts down damage by nearly half. I've never hit over 200 on archer even using Tori's kit while a wiz has their shield up. Even before AB nerf me and tash had to wait til shield dropped to reliably kill a wiz.

Wizzys hit THE hardest compared to any other class considering the gear most of them have. Considering FF is a risk or reward skill I don't feel extra survivability should be added. Wizzys are supposed to be the squishy. Taos don't need extra mp for their green arm but they havent asked to trade it for hp. The point of a wiz is to NOT be hit. Wizards are tactical fighters your not supposed to run in and FF high level players and mobs. You should be playing to your strength.
 

Paloma

Dedicated Member
Dedicated Member
May 3, 2013
219
1
44
HP though would just make them too strong. MP regen would certainly be a nice touch. You could maybe look at 10% anti magic maybe ? An exra MC ?

10% anti-magic keeps the robe in line with the class expectations/lore - and would certainly help. Not sure if this might make them a bit OP in PVP though. What are your thoughts ?

/Mark
Some nice suggestions in this thread to add something but not HP. I like the regen best.
Euro was broken. Wizards were far too powerful but no one has dared to change them. No one even says it.
Just because you could wear any armour you wanted on euro and all p servers followed that model doesnt mean it is the best thing for the game.
One of the things that makes this server so good is that it is euro with a twist and there's some thought gone into the changes whether we like them or not.
 

sarafino

Dedicated Member
Dedicated Member
Apr 21, 2012
105
0
42
I don't understand all this chat about wizzies being OP'd on euro? Yes FF changed the game a lot in terms of pvp but it certainly wasn't without risk. Wiz should always be 1-4 hittable by a war and now obviously sin, depending on the kit to the amount of damage done (obviously...). These Blue armours etc were so rare (until that event) due to the added hp reward of owning one. Armours and pieces of kit like this should exist for all classes on extremely rare items, it doesn't spoil the game dynamics and feel providing not everyone has one.

I've only recently started playing this so obviously I can't say for end game etc, but in general, providing these armours are rare, what is the problem?

Best I can tell a lot of the moaning about spells and power always revolve around examples of the same group of the highest, best kitted players. Why shouldn't these be the most powerful players? They've put the effort into levelling and gaining superior kit to the rest, of course they should be doing a higher damage range. The best way to achieve balance is to base it around the average sort of kit. This way a proper balance can be achieved rather than trying to base everything around the anomaly of players.

Slight rant and off base towards the end there, but the main point is, don't base everything off the top tier of player, it's a sure way to ruin balance.
 

Rollcage

LOMCN Veteran
Veteran
May 11, 2013
372
7
44
I've been going to orcs on my archer since 38...Learn to use your clone. Rep it into mobs and shock easy to survive. Something an archer can't do aswell as use shield witch cuts down damage by nearly half. I've never hit over 200 on archer even using Tori's kit while a wiz has their shield up. Even before AB nerf me and tash had to wait til shield dropped to reliably kill a wiz.

Wizzys hit THE hardest compared to any other class considering the gear most of them have. Considering FF is a risk or reward skill I don't feel extra survivability should be added. Wizzys are supposed to be the squishy. Taos don't need extra mp for their green arm but they havent asked to trade it for hp. The point of a wiz is to NOT be hit. Wizards are tactical fighters your not supposed to run in and FF high level players and mobs. You should be playing to your strength.

never heard so much nonsense come out of a person

dont go in close to use FF...dont even know what to say to that, thats shocking.
more than a few times ive had to quickly use 2 sunpots to recover from the damage from 1 fireshot through my shield.
so the point of a wiz is not to get hit? so our 2 main aoe spells dont require u to be surrounded to make full use of them huh?
tell me, why would taos ask for mp to be changed when thier armor already helps them survive when they otherwise wouldnt?
and ur saying wizzies shouldnt get the same boost in suvivability that every other class gets because what, 255 hp at lvl 48 is reasonable?why does a warrior get 200 hp on thier armor zombie?
 

Phawk

Chronicles Moderator
Dedicated Member
Jun 29, 2011
318
2
45
York, UK
dont go in close to use FF...dont even know what to say to that, thats shocking.
He didnt say that. Again you are misreading posts, and quoting a pointless argument because of it.

more than a few times ive had to quickly use 2 sunpots to recover from the damage from 1 fireshot through my shield.
thats a glass cannon class for you . . .

so the point of a wiz is not to get hit? so our 2 main aoe spells dont require u to be surrounded to make full use of them huh?
The point of ANY ranged calss is not to get hit. TS/FF are in there, and yes it helps to be surrounded. However, that is not what wizzies are designed around. It is nice to have a tao there, or a warrior to LR stuff. Try doing that solo you should expect to get killed. PERIOD. YOU ARE NOT A TANK.

tell me, why would taos ask for mp to be changed when thier armor already helps them survive when they otherwise wouldnt?
Again, misreading the post you've quoted - making your argument pointless. He said taos DON'T get HP, and HAVEN'T asked for it to be changed, even though they need the MP less than wizards.

and ur saying wizzies shouldnt get the same boost in suvivability that every other class gets because what, 255 hp at lvl 48 is reasonable?why does a warrior get 200 hp on thier armor zombie?
A warrior gets the HP because, and I cant state this enough, THEY ARE A TANK CLASS. Wizzies are NOT.

/Mark
 

muffinpie

Golden Oldie
Golden Oldie
Jul 19, 2005
1,099
1
174
Gotta agree with roll here and i dont even play wizzy, infact i have every class 40+ apart from a wizzy which i have never even bothered with on this server, i dont think the armor should add lots of hp but it should maybe a hundred and a higher % regen as the dark armors are all about survivability, it should also have more mc as now crafted 40 armors are better making the item pretty much null and void unless you count the fact it looks pretty, which is useless unless your a show off who wants to stand round in sz showing off how pretty your kit looks.
 

Rollcage

LOMCN Veteran
Veteran
May 11, 2013
372
7
44
He didnt say that. Again you are misreading posts, and quoting a pointless argument because of it.

he did say that, read his post more carefully maybe? "wiz arnt supposed to run in and FF"..you cant stay back and FF can you?

thats a glass cannon class for you . . .

thats my point, hes saying shield is oh so useful, it infact blocks nearly half damage!!! yeh and ive still only got 250 hp so while shield helps alot, its not the best thing since sliced bread

The point of ANY ranged calss is not to get hit. TS/FF are in there, and yes it helps to be surrounded. However, that is not what wizzies are designed around. It is nice to have a tao there, or a warrior to LR stuff. Try doing that solo you should expect to get killed. PERIOD. YOU ARE NOT A TANK.

No..it doesnt help to be surrounded, the spell was made with the caster being surrounded in mind, if you cant see that ur blind as they come, and to suggest there is no element of tanking required when using these spells only makes u look blinder.

Again, misreading the post you've quoted - making your argument pointless. He said taos DON'T get HP, and HAVEN'T asked for it to be changed, even though they need the MP less than wizards.

No..YOU are misreading the post.. taos get both hp and mp on thier armor..so i think ull find im saying ofc they wont ask for MORE hp if thier armor already has SOME to help them survive.

A warrior gets the HP because, and I cant state this enough, THEY ARE A TANK CLASS. Wizzies are NOT.

way to fall into a trap.
so why does every other class get hp on thier armor...? are they tanks?

maybe read a post and make sure u understand it before trying to pick it apart and making urself look a little less competent in the process.
 
Last edited:

Muh

LOMCN Veteran
Veteran
Feb 13, 2014
1,403
236
125
Shield helps a lot when tdb one hits you...
Arm is gd for all but wizard, it does need editing like roll, that I agree on.
A skin means nothing w.o stats.
Look pretty all you want if a shop/crafted item tops it it's worthless lol.
 
Last edited:

Phawk

Chronicles Moderator
Dedicated Member
Jun 29, 2011
318
2
45
York, UK
he did say that, read his post more carefully maybe? "wiz arnt supposed to run in and FF"..you cant stay back and FF can you?



thats my point, hes saying shield is oh so useful, it infact blocks nearly half damage!!! yeh and ive still only got 250 hp so while shield helps alot, its not the best thing since sliced bread



No..it doesnt help to be surrounded, the spell was made with the caster being surrounded in mind, if you cant see that ur blind as they come, and to suggest there is no element of tanking required when using these spells only makes u look blinder.



No..YOU are misreading the post.. taos get both hp and mp on thier armor..so i think ull find im saying ofc they wont ask for MORE hp if thier armor already has SOME to help them survive.



way to fall into a trap.
so why does every other class get hp on thier armor...? are they tanks?

maybe read a post and make sure u understand it before trying to pick it apart and making urself look a little less competent in the process.

I'm giving up arguing with you. I've told you I agree it needs changing. But more HP is NOT the way to go.

not saying any more, before I loose my temper.

/Mark
 

horton

Bitter Berry
Dedicated Member
Sep 17, 2007
241
4
44
I don't understand all this chat about wizzies being OP'd on euro? These Blue armours etc were so rare (until that event)
what is the problem?

This way a proper balance can be achieved rather than trying to base everything around the anomaly of players.

it's a sure way to ruin balance.

Good points But cant remember anyone ever talking about balance back then. Most players were 42-44 at end euro and event was exploited to fk. Everyone wanted to be a wiz tho and had a wiz alt or started one. They were the most effective class even if not OP(base10 rms???).
They aren't the same here n that seems to upset a lot of wiz
 

neptuneshaun

Golden Oldie
Golden Oldie
Jun 17, 2007
550
3
105
TBH as much as I agree with these sort of armours being class locked I also disagree in some aspects.
I agree class locking them as good, but I feel the stats are wrong or could be changed or improvised on.
if wizzies are mentioning about the extra mp (I also agree you don't need it on a wiz) drop down the +200 mp and make it 100MP and 10% Hp regen, this allowing a bit better hp consumption.
Taos is fine as it is with both regen.
and with wars I would say do the mp regen then skills can be leveld afk a lot better but with auto pot this gets rid of that one, but the 100 extra hp and mp+10% regen might make it slightly better but still not what people are after.