Class Balance

[Jicaa]

Not sure where to post this, but move it if you need too

So I just want to know if class balance will be sorted before the introduction of Monk. As it currently stands many things are unbalanced with the current classes, and introducing a new one might complicate things further more.

Assassin:

They actually seem pretty well balanced as a class which deals very quick strong hits, 100-200 each double slash strike with good gear?(not 100% sure). Very strong movement with SS/SF making it hard for range to escape.

Warrior:

Also pretty well balanced, with high gear they hit upwards of 100+ each TDB hit and with much higher HP than an assassin it seems fair enough the trade of regarding damage. Strong movement with the use of shoulderdash.

Taoist:

Always good to have a Taoist in a group, with the buffs and poisoning, they are essential to most boss hunts. With HolyDeva master command they can be very deadly in PvP and have a nice health pool for tough situations. SoulFireBall doesn't seem to hit very well(questionable?). Their movement is basic with nothing added to help, but deva flinching targets helps.

Wizard:

Huge AoE damage, and actually pointless to use single target spells as their AoE spells hit for crazy amounts. Blizzard and MeteorStrike, fair enough they freeze you in spot while it channels so you become vulnerable , but FlameField seems to be hitting for ridiculous amounts as an AoE spell and with MagicShield they effectively have 1.5x-2x the actual HP they have. Mirroring is effectively another HolyDeva, there for flinching. Also basic movement like a Taoist.

Archer:

This class was meant to be a strong single target class, but in fact they seem pretty under powered when a Wizard can do more damage single target with 1 cast of FlameField then an Archer using FireShot, also ArrowBarrage seems garbage since the nerf. Also they have no damage mitigation(magicshield) and with low health they are a pretty easy target. Basic movement, could possible use a Disengage(WoW) type of spell.

I shall probably get flamed for this and feel free too, these are just my opinions of the current classes. If anyone has anything to add or thinks I am wrong about some things(which I probably am) then feel free to post what you think about class balance

This is actually more of a rant about why have you made Wizard so overpowered, they seem to have everything regarding spells.... I love my archer but I don't see the point continuing it when Wizard have everything better than an Archer.

 

[Paloma]

Not sure where to post this, but move it if you need too

So I just want to know if class balance will be sorted before the introduction of Monk. As it currently stands many things are unbalanced with the current classes, and introducing a new one might complicate things further more



Wizard:

Huge AoE damage, and actually pointless to use single target spells as their AoE spells hit for crazy amounts. Blizzard and MeteorStrike, fair enough they freeze you in spot while it channels so you become vulnerable , but FlameField seems to be hitting for ridiculous amounts as an AoE spell and with MagicShield they effectively have 1.5x-2x the actual HP they have. Mirroring is effectively another HolyDeva, there for flinching. Also basic movement like a Taoist.

Archer:

This class was meant to be a strong single target class, but in fact they seem pretty under powered when a Wizard can do more damage single target with 1 cast of FlameField then an Archer using FireShot, also ArrowBarrage seems garbage since the nerf. Also they have no damage mitigation(magicshield) and with low health they are a pretty easy target. Basic movement, could possible use a Disengage(WoW) type of spell.



This is actually more of a rant about why have you made Wizard so overpowered, they seem to have everything regarding spells.... I love my archer but I don't see the point continuing it when Wizard have everything better than an Archer.

No one wants to face up to the idea that wizards are ridiculous. Since euro. Sam tried to tone them down. The screams are still echoing. Easiest to play when all you need to do is mash the ff key and fastest to level. playing a wiz well is harder but mostly doesn't matter

Balanced in relation to what? Can one hit level 11 once 40? Can solo in bdd at 35? Can pvp higher levels once has a certain skill?
I would say pay attention to archer first.

 

[Samuel]

Not sure where to post this, but move it if you need too

So I just want to know if class balance will be sorted before the introduction of Monk. As it currently stands many things are unbalanced with the current classes, and introducing a new one might complicate things further more.

Assassin:

They actually seem pretty well balanced as a class which deals very quick strong hits, 100-200 each double slash strike with good gear?(not 100% sure). Very strong movement with SS/SF making it hard for range to escape.

Warrior:

Also pretty well balanced, with high gear they hit upwards of 100+ each TDB hit and with much higher HP than an assassin it seems fair enough the trade of regarding damage. Strong movement with the use of shoulderdash.

Taoist:

Always good to have a Taoist in a group, with the buffs and poisoning, they are essential to most boss hunts. With HolyDeva master command they can be very deadly in PvP and have a nice health pool for tough situations. SoulFireBall doesn't seem to hit very well(questionable?). Their movement is basic with nothing added to help, but deva flinching targets helps.

Wizard:

Huge AoE damage, and actually pointless to use single target spells as their AoE spells hit for crazy amounts. Blizzard and MeteorStrike, fair enough they freeze you in spot while it channels so you become vulnerable , but FlameField seems to be hitting for ridiculous amounts as an AoE spell and with MagicShield they effectively have 1.5x-2x the actual HP they have. Mirroring is effectively another HolyDeva, there for flinching. Also basic movement like a Taoist.

Archer:

This class was meant to be a strong single target class, but in fact they seem pretty under powered when a Wizard can do more damage single target with 1 cast of FlameField then an Archer using FireShot, also ArrowBarrage seems garbage since the nerf. Also they have no damage mitigation(magicshield) and with low health they are a pretty easy target. Basic movement, could possible use a Disengage(WoW) type of spell.

I shall probably get flamed for this and feel free too, these are just my opinions of the current classes. If anyone has anything to add or thinks I am wrong about some things(which I probably am) then feel free to post what you think about class balance

This is actually more of a rant about why have you made Wizard so overpowered, they seem to have everything regarding spells.... I love my archer but I don't see the point continuing it when Wizard have everything better than an Archer.

Hey Jica,

Assassin - I agree with are fine (in my opinion) high damage, but a little spungey.
Warriors - I think could do with more of a focus shield/tank support type spells, but, overall he isn't too bad.
Taoist - I do think taoist's always get shot in the foot when it comes to the leveling race, I would like to add a small aoe type spell or even pet, and a better soul fire ball.
Wizards - I tried to tone down Wizards as Paloma mentioned, but the community crucified me for it, since we have almost reverted them back to any other server, but I do feel wizards are the most OP class on any server.
Archers - Archers is a tough one, AttunedBody may help in damage mitigation area, but I agree they need some focus.

My plan is to continue bug fixing/adjustments until our next patch, and thereafter focus on the monk and the other aspects that will be released (caves, content etc)... I will certainly spend half an evening looking into Archer balance.

The above is just my thoughts on a page, nothing has been planned yet.

Sam

 

[DiabloVodkaShot]

My i also add that a wizard with level 3 magic booster can achieve 24- 24 mc ( or something along these lines. And also to my knowledge magicbooster sounds bugged in the sense that it in the original versions or mir, it was meant to increase the amount of mana it takes by 2.5

For Example:

Flame field without magicbooster on takes 100 MP
Flame Field with magic booster on takes 250 mp.

Giving wizards an ultimatum when leveling.

 

[Samuel]

My i also add that a wizard with level 3 magic booster can achieve 24- 24 mc ( or something along these lines. And also to my knowledge magicbooster sounds bugged in the sense that it in the original versions or mir, it was meant to increase the amount of mana it takes by 2.5

For Example:

Flame field without magicbooster on takes 100 MP
Flame Field with magic booster on takes 250 mp.

Giving wizards an ultimatum when leveling.

Interesting... A lot of the time (and its pretty obvious) I didn't actually use the newer skills (I stopped playing for a long time), so I base them off descriptions on mir2resource.info (rest in peace) and nearlrun.com (korean mir2resource), do you know if there is any official documentation detailing this?

Sam

 

[Lilcooldoode]

The changes ive been thinking about - to help balance monk in better.

Warrior - Fine if anything slight dps nerf

Assassin - ShadowStep needs to go, automatically replace with backstab if needed.

Taoist - Fine - maybe more dps against mobs

Wizard - All AoE spells to be nerfed - given ShadowStep as GeoManipulation

Archer - AB damage is going to be upped. As will some of their other skills. An 'escape' type spell is needed - ive been thinking of a hookshot type spell where you fire to a target then pull to it or pull it to you (like Thresh lantern if you play LoL)

 

[Razarus]

FlameField is crazy With MagicBooster level 3 and very good kit EW2/lkira are dropping HUGE! amounts of damage to every single spot within the aoe.
Yes they are high level with high kit, balance still needs to come into it.

Cant AOE spells be adjusted to do more damage for the more mobs they hit?? So that they are AOE?
Casting FF (aoe spell) on a single target should NEVER do more damage than a single target spell.

Something like 10% of its damage if only 1 target,
20% - 2 targets, 30% 3 targets, 100% - 10 targets?
I think this would balance the PVP aspect of AOE spells.

Sam I think the Archer needs more than 1 half evening of attention.
I really enjoy playing the Archer but its just not a very good class when it comes to high end content. Could the Archer perhaps get a armour pierce spell (passive) high level like magic booster and gives a (lvl 0)10% -(lvl3)40% chance to ignore armour on hit. combined with a lucky critical hit this could give the archer that end game kill power it needs.
aswell as the other many suggestions already posted.

---------- Post Merged at 12:23 PM ---------- Previous Post was at 12:20 PM ----------

Assassin - ShadowStep needs to go, automatically replace with backstab if needed.

That will upset a lot of people.
The assassin only becomes useful when it has SS, without its a sitting duck.
Not sure you have thought that one through.

Just change wizards Tele spell to be a RT instead of DE. and make it 95% can use on any floor.

 

[Samuel]

Just to say, anything mentioned thus far are just "Ideas" and need to be discussed amongst the team... I don't believe nerfing is the answer, but instead providing the other classes with additional tools to bring them up to the same level (if that makes sense).

Sam

 

[YOSHIMOTO]

Don't let Lilcooldoode kill your server Sam...


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Koriban]

I think all classes besides the archer and wizard are actually in a good spot.

Warriors: Fine - has some ridiculous end-game potential but a lot of different types of gems needed on kit to obtain this.

Assassins: Fine (lots of utility, mad single dps - I think ShadowStep is key for this class to survive tbh lil)

Taoists: Fine, needs more DPS vs Mobs. New pet perhaps to aid this?

Archers: In a very poor state. I think they need to be swapped to deal AC Damage, not AMC. This allows Tiger neckies to not be abused against them and also means they should kill wizzies,tao's,sins, much easier.

Wizards: Honestly, I think the real issue here is MagicShield. It gives far too much survivability. I want wizzies to do mass-aoe Damage and they deserve that for having to go through the first 4months of the server as useless, but they need to die QUICKLY. This is not happening atm (especially due to SunPotions being so readily available) Currently anything that's not TDB gets reduced to barely any damage when shield is up. I think halving the amount of damage this thing absorbs (ac/amc wise) would be an acceptable Nerf, but wizzies need to keep their damage.

Honestly not much needs to change, I haven't seen a moan thread in ages and each class fills it's niche well. Monk class needs to fulfill a different niche for it to fit into the current system. If it's just a "jack of all trades master of none" class, it's going to do poorly.

Remember, end-game wise which we are nearing, warriors have to put the most effort in (slow gems, pa gems, storm gems, dc gems, acc gems) to obtain godlike status.

Sins need Slow, Acc, Agil, DC for godlike status.

Archers need... reworking. Doesn't matter what they do they die too fast and do too little damage to make up for it.

Tao's and wizzies can put in the least amount of effort to obtain their end-game godlike status, just MC/SC Gems.

This is why wizzies are usually so dominant late game, because they can achieve crazy stats with so very little effort as opposed to the other classes. MagicBooster giving 24-24MC only further hurts the situation. This is why I propose wizzies need to die quicker, as currently with MagicShield and a bunch of sunbundles in your bag, you can tank and dish out 400+Damage FF's in a 3x3 area constantly.

The damage is fine, but the survivability isn't.

Just my 2 cents.

 

[KingTony]

Archers - Archers is a tough one, AttunedBody may help in damage mitigation area, but I agree they need some focus.
Sam

I've said this loads of times on here.. this was probably your worst choice of spell to give archers, giving them a spell that works like a hp pot(but slower) when we already have hp pots seems pointless to me.

Maybe you should try reverting static shot back to how it used to be, when it actually bounced on you (even if you are running) along with the faster bounces.

Archer - AB damage is going to be upped. As will some of their other skills. An 'escape' type spell is needed - ive been thinking of a hookshot type spell where you fire to a target then pull to it or pull it to you (like Thresh lantern if you play LoL)

I personally don't like you idea with the hook type spell. Archers single target damage is fine (fireshot, pretty much the only spell you will ever have to use) with 120 dc i used to hit anything from 200-320 but you are very limited in what you can do in pvp because no doubt you will have atleast 3-4 meele chasing you in guild fights and you dont even get the chance to cast and if you do your probably going to die doing it.

Archers need a better decoy type spell, maybe something that is instant with a higher cooldown of maybe 10-15 seconds, piercing shot also needs removed imo and giving a whole new spell.

The main reason i stopped playing this is because i could see how much effort i've put in, just as much as everyone else and i felt like my character was not progressing like all they other classes were, i didnt like the idea of adding buff spells for higher level when they were already lacking so much along with the crappy pvp archers have to put up with.. ill probably roll a monk when they get released but i cant ever see me going back to an archer.

 

[DeeKayDee]

Could not agree more Kori

 

[Lilcooldoode]

Backstab is basically the same as shadowstep isnt it? Apart from you need a target

 

[Razarus]

Backstab is basically the same as shadowstep isnt it? Apart from you need a target

Much shorter distance on Backstab i'm lead to believe and also consider that shadow step is not always used to go into combat, its often used to get out of combat.

While you have wizards flamefielding for 300-600 damage perhaps a teleport next to enemy spell is not the best idea for a low health assassin, maybe teleport away from target is whats needed...

 

[Koriban]

Backstab is basically the same as shadowstep isnt it? Apart from you need a target

Shorter distance, but most importantly needs a target. I primarily see decent skilled sins use this spell to keep people at bay, dash in and dash out of fights. Honestly so far this skill has made me see who's a good and who's a bad sin, which means it's a good spell that I think they should keep.

Personally I think BackStab should be a one-time use high damage opening strike spell for sins. Would go well with Stealth spell when/if that ever comes into the game.

As for your hookshot, do you mean like Nautilus's Anchor Q Spell? I think that would be pretty cool, but it would need to be an instant teleport rather than an S-dash type spell.

 

[rainstone]

My opinion is compare every class at the same level!

If you want to look into a 52 wizz with level 3 magicbooster, then compare it to a level 52 warrior or taoist.

Wiz has (277?) less then 300hp when reach level 50!.

Again, for these who are moaning about wizz do a lot of damage: get your ass to level 50, then we could talk. I am not 52 yet.

 

[Razarus]

My opinion is compare every class at the same level!

If you want to look into a 52 wizz with level 3 magicbooster, then compare it to a level 52 warrior or taoist.

Wiz has (277?) less then 300hp when reach level 50!.

Again, for these who are moaning about wizz do a lot of damage: get your ass to level 50, then we could talk. I am not 52 yet.

I wish level was all that mattered here rainstone.
But a level 52 wiz gains so much more than a level 52 any other class.
Gaining MIN MC from magic booster is just stupid.

 

[Adv]

Not read alot of posts here but to back Lilcooldude up on removal of SS (Which i also think is very OP), substitute it for a similar spell.

Make it a targeted spell, by this i mean you have to cast it on a target (player or mob) for it to work. Also, make it place the casting assassin in a square on the other side of the target (Opening nice gateway tricks for backstab when/if ever implemented)

This removes the total freedom of the screen and limits the sin to only jumping to a target. This way they can still use it to close in on targets, and to escape lures (by jumping to outside fringe mobs), but limits them just vanishing from sight at will.

Think Irelias Q or better (Cause shes an assassin!) Katas E

EDIT: Ohhh okay i just read the thread properly. You guys seem to have different ideas of what backstab is to mine. Backstab to me is when an assassin is melee hitting a target that is facing away from it, triggering a damage multiplier. You guys are more of a jump behind spell (Which is what im saying above lol) Take from this post what u want, the ideas are there i guess.

 

[ziiid]

Additionally level comparisons are also not viable if it takes 2 or 3 times longer to level the other class compared to the wiz. ie if it takes 2-3 times longer to level a tao then 52 to 52 isnt a viable comparison.

Archers do seem to be in a poor place atm.

In addition to your list Koriban sins will prolly have to gear HP as the end game progresses further.

Seems a little silly that the single skill that makes sins viable is also the most expensive skill in game?

 

[rainstone]

Level is not the all things but only represents how much time people put in.
I am sorry that you do not have much time spent in the game. So maybe you should not talk about your opinions because you do not know this server that much.
I do not want to start flame and I think my point was quite clear and loud. If you do not agree, then leave it.

I wish level was all that mattered here rainstone.
But a level 52 wiz gains so much more than a level 52 any other class.
Gaining MIN MC from magic booster is just stupid.