Global Cooldown for warrior/sin spells

[Razarus]

So it boils down to the fact that warriors think they should be able to cast TDB every swing regardless of circumstances or global cooldowns even thought its not a toggle on/off skill.

You have a basic swing that does basic damage for a reason surly?

 

[DeeKayDee]

So it boils down to the fact that warriors think they should be able to cast TDB every swing regardless of circumstances or global cooldowns even thought its not a toggle on/off skill.

You have a basic swing that does basic damage for a reason surly?

Not just tdb, that was just an example .. you can't do anything after you cast .. you are forced to use a basic attack.


Going back to the assassin example, would you be frustrated if your attacks went to the default basic attack (ie. no haste) .. after you cast an attacking spell ?

 

[Razarus]

Going back to the assassin example, would you be frustrated if your attacks went to the default basic attack (ie. no haste) .. after you cast an attacking spell ?

Absolutely but that's not what rage is doing. Its not removing any previous used spells from you.
Does casting rage also debuf protection field? ultima enhancer? blessed armour? soul shield? don't think so.

a Sin cant HS - Haste directly after each other. they would hit 2-3 times normally between casts

War - Cast Rage - CHM - CHM - TDB - FS - TDB -TDB
Sin - HS - DS - DS -HS - DS - DS - MoonLight - DS - DS - Haste - DS - DS - Light Body


If you "charge FS" then use rage does it remove the charged FS? if it does that should not happen.

You should be able to charge FS (not use it) Use Rage, Then open your attacks by using the FS

so you get - Rage - FS - Normal - TDB -TDB

 

[Phawk]

Absolutely but that's not what rage is doing. Its not removing any previous used spells from you.
Does casting rage also debuf protection field? ultima enhancer? blessed armour? soul shield? don't think so.

a Sin cant HS - Haste directly after each other. they would hit 2-3 times normally between casts

War - Cast Rage - CHM - CHM - TDB - FS - TDB -TDB
Sin - HS - DS - DS -HS - DS - DS - MoonLight - DS - DS - Haste - DS - DS - Light Body


If you "charge FS" then use rage does it remove the charged FS? if it does that should not happen.

You should be able to charge FS (not use it) Use Rage, Teh open your attacks by using the FS

so you get - Rage - FS - Normal - TDB -TDB

I actually agree more with this line of thinking.

/Mark

 

[Razarus]

Maybe you should start a poll
Should TDB be a toggle on/off skill

If it gets voted yes and the team agree then it will fix this global cooldown issue aswell as it will default to TDB after rage is used providing its switched on.

 

[DeeKayDee]

Absolutely but that's not what rage is doing. Its not removing any previous used spells from you.
Does casting rage also debuf protection field? ultima enhancer? blessed armour? soul shield? don't think so.

Haste was a bad example, I was trying not to use FD because many see that as broken too .. point being that if you use an attacking spell, be it FD, Rage, HS - Why should you be limited to use a basic attack afterwards ? Wasn't meaning a debuf of a spell, that would be silly

If you "charge FS" then use rage does it remove the charged FS? if it does that should not happen.

You should be able to charge FS (not use it) Use Rage, Then open your attacks by using the FS

so you get - Rage - FS - Normal - TDB -TDB

Agree and that is the case, the argument being that we should be able to charge our spells regardless of activating Rage or not (again this is highlighted more the fact we only get a few seconds of this buff, so every second counts)

Maybe you should start a poll
Should TDB be a toggle on/off skill

If it gets voted yes and the team agree then it will fix this global cooldown issue aswell as it will default to TDB after rage is used providing its switched on.

Nah wouldn't happen mate, too easy mode

 

[Razarus]

Then we can start a poll to make FlashDash tie in with double slash so that one of the strikes is a FD the other is normal so that it doesn't disrupt the attack speed so much.

---------- Post Merged at 03:21 PM ---------- Previous Post was at 03:12 PM ----------

point being that if you use an attacking spell, be it FD, Rage, HS - Why should you be limited to use a basic attack afterwards ?

But you're not limited to a normal attack you can still use your toggle skills. CHM/HM/DS
Do you think a sin should be able to FlashDash - Heavenly Sword - FlashDash - HeavenlySword all at aspeed 8 with no global cooldown between them? I can assure you most sins would never bother with DoubleSlash if they could HeavenlySword without any global cooldown effectvely heavenlyswording at aspeed 8.

Agree and that is the case, the argument being that we should be able to charge our spells regardless of activating Rage or not (again this is highlighted more the fact we only get a few seconds of this buff, so every second counts)

Is the case?
So if you charge FS then use Rage you lose the FS charge?
That is the fix id be asking for, so that you can strategically use rage to boost your DC ready for a killer FS that you already have charged to use.

As far as I can tell TDB is the only castable skill that stacks with aspeed for a melee class.
So the expectancy to have this every hit is the biggest issue,
If its supposed to stack with aspeed and be used every hit it should be on a toggle.
If its not, then it needs a global cooldown itself.

 

[DeeKayDee]

But you're not limited to a normal attack you can still use your toggle skills. CHM/HM/DS

Agree but when you're killing a single target why would you be XHMing ? :P

Do you think a sin should be able to FlashDash - Heavenly Sword - FlashDash - HeavenlySword all at aspeed 8 with no global cooldown between them? I can assure you most sins would never bother with DoubleSlash if they could HeavenlySword without any global cooldown effectvely heavenlyswording at aspeed 8.

No because they have a global cooldown, we're not talking about spells with global cooldowns - tdb/fs don't have a global cooldown, you can spam these as you please

Is the case?
So if you charge FS then use Rage you lose the FS charge?
That is the fix id be asking for, so that you can strategically use rage to boost your DC ready for a killer FS that you already have charged to use.

No sorry I meant you can actually do that, charge FS then Rage then get 1 attack in, but then you still lose the swings afterwards .. so for a pvp aspect, sure you get that killer FS in.. but then you're stood like a lemon swinging 2-3 basic attacks while the person lol's and pots back up to full

 

[Phawk]

I dont agree with TDB being on auto attack at all. TDB is a special, like FS, like FD - it should be 'triggered' It is OP enough that it doesn't have CD ON it at all lol

/Mark

 

[Koriban]

Then we can start a poll to make FlashDash tie in with double slash so that one of the strikes is a FD the other is normal so that it doesn't disrupt the attack speed so much.

---------- Post Merged at 03:21 PM ---------- Previous Post was at 03:12 PM ----------

But you're not limited to a normal attack you can still use your toggle skills. CHM/HM/DS
Do you think a sin should be able to FlashDash - Heavenly Sword - FlashDash - HeavenlySword all at aspeed 8 with no global cooldown between them? I can assure you most sins would never bother with DoubleSlash if they could HeavenlySword without any global cooldown effectvely heavenlyswording at aspeed 8.






Is the case?
So if you charge FS then use Rage you lose the FS charge?
That is the fix id be asking for, so that you can strategically use rage to boost your DC ready for a killer FS that you already have charged to use.

As far as I can tell TDB is the only castable skill that stacks with aspeed for a melee class.
So the expectancy to have this every hit is the biggest issue,
If its supposed to stack with aspeed and be used every hit it should be on a toggle.
If its not, then it needs a global cooldown itself.

Problem is when you're fighting a wizz the last thing you want to do is waste time using FlameSword as it does absolutely nothing to them with Shield up. In every other case I'd agree, but to be honest opening with a TDB is much more beneficial just incase it yellow poisons them.

As sam said the delay between spells is off on here, I'm hoping he can get it fixed.

 

[Razarus]

Agree but when you're killing a single target why would you be XHMing ? :P

haha cant have it all ways mate.

No because they have a global cooldown, we're not talking about spells with global cooldowns - tdb/fs don't have a global cooldown, you can spam these as you please

Oh I see, so you think that a global cooldown should only effect other global cooldown skills. making it more of a "globalcooldownskill-globalcooldown" I haven't really given that one any thought, so I guess most of my points aren't that relevant.

No sorry I meant you can actually do that, charge FS then Rage then get 1 attack in, but then you still lose the swings afterwards .. so for a pvp aspect, sure you get that killer FS in.. but then you're stood like a lemon swinging 2-3 basic attacks while the person lol's and pots back up to full

Use Rage FS for archers and unshielded wizzies and sins and don't use it for taos/wars?


maybe extend the duration of rage by 3 seconds to combat the global cooldown, so you still get a full durations use but you have to chose wisley where and when you use it.
Its a little like battle rage/bloodlust the caster tends to hit their chest 2-3 times or shake their heads randomly before charging in and doing damage.
the gorilla chest thump is your global cooldown. =)

I'm not over bothered either way with this one as I can see the reasoning why its happening but also the frustration when it does.
I guess if a Buff feels like a debuff and its not down to play skill/style then maybe it could be adjusted.

As Sam said earlier maybe it should only be 2 normal hits after the cast instead of 4 - so if 1 of those 2 is a strategically places pre charged FS then that would offer the fluidity the skills need imo.


good luck =)

---------- Post Merged at 03:50 PM ---------- Previous Post was at 03:48 PM ----------

I dont agree with TDB being on auto attack at all. TDB is a special, like FS, like FD - it should be 'triggered' It is OP enough that it doesn't have CD ON it at all lol

/Mark

Nor do I,
But if its going to stay castable on every hit at any attack speed then it may aswell be toggled to on.

 

[Koriban]

I suppose easier option is to just increase LR/Entrap/Rage timer by about 1 or 2 seconds to combat the "delay"

TDB is already castable every swing at every attack speed, making it togglable won't actually change anything but I suppose it's more work.

 

[Phawk]

Nor do I,
But if its going to stay castable on every hit at any attack speed then it may aswell be toggled to on.

In that case, i'd like tbolt to be togglable on my wiz, and SFB on my tao please

(yes, i'm being extreme, but you see where this leads - not having a pop at you as I know you agree)

/Mark

 

[DeeKayDee]

Oh I see, so you think that a global cooldown should only effect other global cooldown skills. making it more of a "globalcooldownskill-globalcooldown" I haven't really given that one any thought, so I guess most of my points aren't that relevant.

It's very hard to explain, I'll try break it down a little - In my opinion..

spells such as LR, Entrap, BA, HeavenlySword, Wiz spells (defensive/ranged skills) should and do have a global cooldown (x seconds before able to do anything)

spells such as Rage/TDB/FS/pro field, FlashDash, DoubleSlash, PoisonSword (attacking/buffs) should not have a global cooldown (can attack straight after)


Rage and FD need to be inline with the rest

 

[Koriban]

In that case, i'd like tbolt to be togglable on my wiz, and SFB on my tao please

(yes, i'm being extreme, but you see where this leads - not having a pop at you as I know you agree)

/Mark

But this makes absolutely no sense?

If you were to "toggle" tbolt, you'd be bolting every single chance you can. Meaning you'd have to run, flick your mouse over to the thing you want to target, run again, flick back, run again. (This is impossible to do for extended periods of time, I've tried it on an archer and is the reason why a few people got caught cheating)

Meaning if it was toggled on you couldn't simply just "run" away from anything, you'd ALWAYS be casting tbolt. Lets use FF as an example instead. Still would be a terrible thing to do, if you get stuck and need to move but your FF is toggled on you'd FF instead of walk.

Doing so would not aid a wizard at all. It would actually probably get them killed. I fail to see the comparison?

 

[Lilcooldoode]

I can confirm this delay also exists on ruby: Rage - Normal Hit - Normal Hit - FlamingSword Hit

It just the normal delay between spell casts. Thats not to say it can't be changed on here but it would need proper debait/vote i guess.

 

[d1craig]

In that case, i'd like tbolt to be togglable on my wiz, and SFB on my tao please

(yes, i'm being extreme, but you see where this leads - not having a pop at you as I know you agree)

/Mark

the other difference is TDB tales MP every 0.2 seconds of you hold the button. Tbolt takes it every time the spell fires.

 

[DeeKayDee]

I can confirm this delay also exists on ruby: Rage - Normal Hit - Normal Hit - FlamingSword Hit

It just the normal delay between spell casts. Thats not to say it can't be changed on here but it would need proper debait/vote i guess.

Thanks for confirming - Guess i'll just have to try get upto lvl3 so it lasts abit longer