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[C# Files] Apocalypse Mir
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Just something regarding the lvling cap. There are 2 options.
- Either hard cap it (and face the "issues" some ppl mentioned here which aint important imo but neway)
- Or dont have a cap which is cool but could have the issues Chronicles had with 2 ppl 10-15lvls above average with whatever problems this could cause to your server.
Soft-cap is a bad thing and cant work in any way that makes sense.
- Either hard cap it (and face the "issues" some ppl mentioned here which aint important imo but neway)
- Or dont have a cap which is cool but could have the issues Chronicles had with 2 ppl 10-15lvls above average with whatever problems this could cause to your server.
Soft-cap is a bad thing and cant work in any way that makes sense.
- Dec 2, 2005
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There is no real Cap. But for mir a Soft Cap is always the better option. Levelling becomes hard. It will not be like mentioned servers, the jump between levels at 48+ is high, this is to ensure server longevity.
-Apocalypse Team
Yes but what exactly you gonna do when you want to remove that softcap on some sort of expansion?
1) Just change the exp tables and have some ppl jump 3-4lvls?
2) Change the exp tables and dont compensate the ppl that gainned some decent exp at lvl cap?
3) Wont change the exp tables but instead make the expansion mobs give 3x-4x the older mobs exp which would make the older caves a bit pointless?
Imo soft cap is a very bad idea and only causes more issues than it actually solves.
- Dec 2, 2005
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None of the above. The soft cap will start at 48+ but will still be a realistic amount of exp to be gathered, but rather than taking a week to level it may take a few weeks to gain one level. Just as mir should be. New expansions will never have a massive jump.
Let me give you an example to clear things up on how expansions will work on Apocalypse:
X mob (highest tier) will give 2650 exp
New expansion mob will give 3100 exp
(these exp examples are no where near a true reflection, just an idea of how it works)
that's roughly a 17% increase, which encourages players to level slightly further, but not much more than 1-2 levels without it becoming difficult again due to how the exp pools work.
The exp progression has been thought out very well, and work for server longevity and will be very unlikely to have anyone 10 levels ahead of the average levels.
-Apocalypse Team
Yes but if the soft cap is a bigger raise (would be at a guess) than 17% + your desired increased % difficulty from lvl to lvl (usually a soft cap is something like 500% exp compared to last lvl) then this cap isnt removed from that expansion. Am i wrong somewhere?
- Dec 2, 2005
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It's not that your wrong, its that you are making an assumption. The Soft cap for Apocalypse is customised so essentially could be 110% if we really wanted, but its not.
There is as mentioned many times, no cap at all, but to ensure that there are not players 15 levels higher than the average level, there has been put in some thought about the exp pools that will make it difficult after a certain point for players to jump from level to level, but not impossible.
-Apocalypse Team
- May 19, 2003
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I'm likely wrong on this as it's confusing me also, but wasn't option 3 that squall provided the same as your description of how it works?
x3-x4 was an over estimate, but the idea is the same - you're maxing the soft cap level high enough exp that people won't usually want to level past it as no current mobs provide sufficient exp - then once the expansion comes out you're adding mobs which give this higher exp allows people to level easier (until the new soft cap is reached)
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I expect you've worked out the details, but to me it seems the exp required on this soft cap level would need to be dramatically higher than the previous levels to deter people from levelling further - thus needing to add new expansion mobs which provide dramatically higher exp to balance out the levelling length - thus making previous caves a little pointless since the newer caves provide such better exp - thus my need to say thus.
You said the new expansion mob exp will have a rough gain of 17% - which means your soft cap level can only be max of about 25% increase in exp required so the level progression doesn't suddenly become ridiculous.
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In summary, if my understanding is correct - this method will only work if the expansion mobs are considerably harder, and you're provided with considerably better gear in the cave before - so that lower levels have no chance to complete these caves without first reaching the required level and gaining the better kit.
x3-x4 was an over estimate, but the idea is the same - you're maxing the soft cap level high enough exp that people won't usually want to level past it as no current mobs provide sufficient exp - then once the expansion comes out you're adding mobs which give this higher exp allows people to level easier (until the new soft cap is reached)
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I expect you've worked out the details, but to me it seems the exp required on this soft cap level would need to be dramatically higher than the previous levels to deter people from levelling further - thus needing to add new expansion mobs which provide dramatically higher exp to balance out the levelling length - thus making previous caves a little pointless since the newer caves provide such better exp - thus my need to say thus.
You said the new expansion mob exp will have a rough gain of 17% - which means your soft cap level can only be max of about 25% increase in exp required so the level progression doesn't suddenly become ridiculous.
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In summary, if my understanding is correct - this method will only work if the expansion mobs are considerably harder, and you're provided with considerably better gear in the cave before - so that lower levels have no chance to complete these caves without first reaching the required level and gaining the better kit.
- Dec 2, 2005
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As mentioned now for the 6th time :P, there is no soft cap. Instead an increase in the exp pools which makes it harder to level, expansions will allow this levelling to become faster, but the word faster is an overstatement as it will still remain hard.
If you played Euro mir 2 (where this whole game started) You will understand we are following a similar theme to theirs in terms of the exp increases, but we are expecting a little higher than 43 to be the average as it was on there. We expect players to comfortably hit 43 after a good amount of time, and to progress even further.
-Apocalypse Team
- May 19, 2003
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Pretty sure what you're doing is a 'soft cap'. Where as a hard cap limits people to a max level have will not allow them to gain 1exp higher, a soft cap simply raises the bar to an amount that people won't want to level. The methods of soft/hard cap's are used throughout all mmo games.
As an after thought, the soft cap method can also work if you reduce the exp given by mobs lower level than you. That way once you're level 47, you can't just continue to kill level 46 mobs and gain the same exp at the same rate - instead you have to wait for an expansion where level 47 mobs come in to play and provide you with enough exp.
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- Dec 2, 2005
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I have been saying for the last 15-20 pages there will be no cap, but it seems the question keeps raising from the same few users, so to help people understand I used the terminology they want to hear but clearly stated that there is no soft cap.
A cap refers to stopping players level. That is not the intention here AT ALL!
We are just working hard to ensure players are not going to be (for example) level 56 within 6 months when majority of the server are 46. The minute this happens, the vast difference in levels for certain users causes huge problems.. such as: The crazy high level players being able to kill everyone, If we then stop this happening, then where is the encouragement for players to level past 45?
I will be happy for there to be valid reasons in items/skills to level up and to benefit from the hard work players put in. But I don't want the server to be openly spread with all Varity of levels.
To make the game extremely exciting you want people on as much of a level playing field as possible, Items/skills are a little RNG and take time to obtain, but levels imo are the balanced ground on Apocalypse, which for players even without the top skills gives them the opportunity to compete.
-Apocalypse Team
- Aug 5, 2013
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To jump in here, thats probably where the confusion is being cause right there. A hard cap implies that, a soft cap implies nothing of the sort. Far explained the principle very accurately and correctly above.
You're describing your server as having a very light soft cap (as most people will understand it).
Not that it matters, you have described what you are doing in detail, so a whatever its called is pretty moot at this point.
- Dec 2, 2005
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I was under the impression a hard cap implies that once you hit a certain level you will no longer be able to gain exp.
A soft cap implies that once you reach a certain level, it will become very difficult to increase such exp.
I don't see where I said anything would ever stop.
I think the confusion actually comes from other MMO's and players expectations for mir compared to other games.
We understand this, and have been as adapting as possible, but when it comes to levelling, we are following the traditional mir route with no level cap
-Apocalypse Team
- Feb 16, 2011
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like next week ish i think fella. will be good to test this. really is no other mir servers i can be arsed to play atm / saying that most are corrupt or buggy and gms no clue
- Dec 2, 2005
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We will be streaming tonight at around 8pm. we will post on here before hand to let people know.
-Apocalypse Team
- Apr 5, 2011
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